Nissan Responds to GT-R 'Ring Time Accusations

and if Nissan so sure about GT-R capabilities, why not settle this on Track, show us some action ;)

You don't think Porsche...? Nooo... the Germans aren't that silly are they...?

This is vital to the GTR reputation- their advertisement agency came up with that statement.

Now what is true or false we will NEVER know! unless a third unbiased party bought a GTR randomly and got the same driver to drive the ring ...

Soo in the end its win win .. porsche can calm the GTR is secondary to its products keeping its enthusiasts happy

and Nissan saves face for its GTR owners..

To blindly believe both of them is foolish ... its win win for both companies.

the car is good, I love it very much, but it's not like Porsche cars...it's another feeling....not the same standards...don't just start yelling like that...

why not showing some real things?

instead of taking on the challenge in a constructive manner, Porsche is reacting like a 6 year old whos' just been OWNED!

that's what it looks like from beneath ;)

Just to lett you know that the F430 and 599GTB are way behind the 911's in the Nurburgring lap times, not mentioning the GTR, so then Ferrari is worser then Porsche cause their cars are a lot more expensive then Porsches

as if they could teach a legend like Walter Roehrl some driving skills, haha mugs (and cheats)!

"...now the math is never absolute, but to say the gap between 911 and GT-R is impossible is just dismissive and ignorant."

The math is never absolute... meaning you can't plug in the differences on one track and extrapolate onto another. Any 7th grader would have understood my statement.

My point was that if it the GT-R could manage a 5 second gap at Buttonwillow in California heat in June, then it is indeed IGNORANT to think it's impossible to do have the margin of victory that it did at the Nurburgring... in much cooler weather and on a lower friction surface where it's AWD and torque vectoring (the 911 lacks the latter) would give it more of an advantage.

Go back to playing with your Hot Wheels. Leave the grown up conversations to grownups.

5 SECONDS! In 2.73 miles! and on a 14miles track it only can pull 8 a 9 seconds away of the Turbo, i think your not so realistic if i may say so. your telling bullsh*t

@ mc959:

Go look up GT-R vs. Z06 & 911. Plug in the words "Buttonwillow" and "Steve Millen". I would tell you exactly where to look, but these blog cops might delete my post again. Anyways, when you find it just sit someplace quiet and reflect on how silly you made yourself look.

They are not 8-year-olds, so there is no reason to get into a pissing match or respond with anything beneath Japanese politeness. I would imagine the statement came from their internal PR department, approved by Legal, and not from their ad agency in Hakuhodo. This is as polite, assertive and factual a response as anyone should expect, and befitting a Japanese automaker who is confident enough in their product to perform honest testing.

I know Mizuno-san well enough to appreciate that an unearned record would mean nothing to him. And since he does know how to drive a 911 (he had one along for the entire development and testing process), he and his drivers might have the upper hand on getting the most out of both cars.

In this segment (on 'Ring times) Porsche used to rule, then Nissan toppled it, then Chevy went one up on everyone with the ZR1... and Dodge brought it's bad boy brawler equipped with adjustable aero, adjustable suspension and R-compound rubber and made it look like a stroll in the park... It's progress.

Next we look to the next gen PDK and DI equipped 911s to try & upset the order... or Nissan's GT-R V-Spec, whichever comes first. You guys need to quit the crying & excuses, and get rid of the douchebag elitist attitudes. True automotive fans respect all automotive accomplishments, irrespective of brand.

wow I just can't believe how unwilling people are to take reality at face value and accept it. People keep arguing that the Nurburgring time cannot be real.

If the Nissan had only beaten Porsche on the Nurburgring then I would understand; reason and logic would have had a playing ground on which to state such accusations BUT that's not how it has been.

On my lap is a magazine with an actual test done on the same day; same conditions etc. The Rockingham's infield circuit. Times?

Porsche Turbo: 83.20s Nissan GT-R: 82.20s and for interest's sakes Audi R8: 83.83s

Keeping in mind that

1 the test driver has a fair bit of experience driving Porsche 911 Turbos

2 he consistently delivered better times in the GT-R even with it being his "virgin-run" in it (and at the owner's request to not crash it)

3 in the article; mention is made of how the GT-R can keep going into a corner when you have had to slow down in the Turbo. Last I checked the best ways to get times out of tracks is to lose as little speed as possible around corners.

The ATTESA system is part of why the GT-R can do what it does. The Prodrive P2 works on a similar principle; basically torque-splitting.

This is why it made sense to me that the GT-R is capable of such a great time on the track

Top Gear track times: 1:24.3 – Prodrive P2 Active diff. on 1:29.0 – Prodrive P2 Active diff. off

Topgear tested them as well:

1:19.7 – Nissan GT-R CBA-R35 1:19.8 – Porsche Carrera GT

unfortunately the Porsche Turbo's time was tested when it was very wet but on Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Gear_Test_Track) mention is made of time adjustments made according to the track's state.

7s is deducted from the official time for very wet tracks.

Even if we deducted 10s from the Turbo's time it gives us a time on the Topgear track of: 1:21:00

the time would have been around 1:24:00 officially though.

Porsche still makes great cars nonetheless; I would be honoured to die in a Carrera GT but let's just accept that Nissan did what it did.

Do these guys ever grow Up????

Porsche will never admit that the GT-R is faster and Nissan will never admit if they cheated on the results !!!

Get a life and deal with it !!!!

People will still buy 911's, because it's a Porsche and people will still buy a GT-R, because it's cheap and an Awesome car!!!

Porsche fanatics won't just decide to buy the GT-R just because of this time and those who can't afford the Porsche will have to settle for the GT-R anyway. Sure you might say a Nissan is still just a Nissan but the Nissan has proven triumphant this time around. Porsche will regain their title when they release their next speed-demon.

If power-to-weight is all it is about maybe we should have seen more Lotuses near the top of the ring times. Clearly not then.

Porsche is not that kind of a company that would make claims like this unless there was a good reason. I personaly find it very suspicious that a car with 480hp that weights 200 kg more than the porsche turbo could beat all of those supercars like that......oh no..i forgot that the engine is hand bulit and the power may vary..yeah right..it might vary a few horsepower but not by 70. have you ever seen an 55 amg motor put out 570 stock? this is too much of a deviation. i am convinced that this is done by nissan on purpose. either all gtrs have more power or maybe just the press cars ..i dont know but either way its a pretty nasty move from nissan, because it makes the cars look much better than thy are....i mean no wonder it beats the porsche if it packs another secret 70 horsepower. if it has more power than thats fine, but they should say it......i think its even illegal to rate the car less hp than it actually has, but they will always blame it on the fact that the emgines are hand bulit and that it can vary...smart move nissan. also none will concvince me that the car that did the run wasnt tuned even beyond that...minor tweaks..what dos that mean please?

I think this press release that nissan brought out is quite in insult...are they trying to say that porsche didnt drive the car properly and that it wasnt driven in properly...that is a joke even if those tricks get dicovered it too late anyway..because nissan already achievd what they wanted...the hype. no matter if its true or not, in the minds of people, the nissan will stay as some kind of a miracle of ingeneering that can beat all cars in the world with only 480hp. another ineteresting point is that nissan wont make any profit on the gtr. They will only get their money back later from the infinity model. isnt that strange? you can write in the discussion why u think that is..iam curious what u think.

http://fifthgear.five.tv/jsp/5gmain.jsp?mnk=410&id=255&description=Bruno+Senna

I emphasize the yet because it's just a matter of time before other makes get to do what most of you refer to as "impossible"... and when that happens along with the praise you will shower on these makes, you better prepare to retract all these statements about Nissan being a fraud.

It might not make sense to you; then again flight by aeroplanes was wrongly attributed to Bernoulli's equation and a difference in pressure because that is what made sense but that logic was proven wrong.

You guys should pick up a book on modern physics; tell me if it makes "logical sense" and then tell me that it's all BS. If you can do that and prove it then and only then can you tell me that the GT-R couldn't do what it did.

Just buy the damn car, shut up and drive it, full stop.

stop whinging people's and no matter what people say, no car is better than another, Its up to the owner.

Wins in le mans Porsche=16(most victories!!!) and Nissan=0

That's why you pay more money for a Porsche

and last but not least best overal time on the Ring:

6:11.13 Porsche 956 Gr. C Stefan Bellof 28 May 1983 n/a 2nd qualifier (and winner) in same event (199.005 km/h)

where's Nissan now????

that time of the ring is just a fact, when the skyline had about 200hp back in 1983, and if you really believe that this Nissan can beat supercars, like the 599gtb, F430, Lambo LP640, GT2,... with only 480 HP(+/-50HP to 160HP less then the cars mentioned above) and extra weight(+/- 100kg too 200kg more then on cars mentioned above)then u believe in Santa Claus too. we'll speak again when the euro-spec hits the road in a couple of month's, even waiting for the V-SPEC, Porsche will answer on the road like it should be wait for the 998 TURBO and GT2, u'll see

You're such a sore-loser I swear. If Porsche had won the showdown I would have given them their due; just that in this instance, as has been proven many times before, the GT-R won. How do you know the Porsche hadn't been tweaked either? supposing what you saying is true?

- Has NO turbo lag, compared to the Porsche - Best part of the car is the gearbox, much faster gear change than the Porsche (and a GP2 car) - Is so much easier to drive on the limit, he doesn’t even have to look forwards…

Think the above 3 factors mainly contribute to the faster lap time.

I think they are both fine cars and I would be happy with either sitting on my driveway… However, the Nissan is only half the price of the Porsche Turbo.

well anyway.. the thing that i am trying to tell you all the time is that the nissan keeps wining because its alway tweaked beyond the stock specs. if the porsche also had like 70secret horsepower it would easily be as fast as the nissan. how do i know the porsche wasnt tweaked? well i dont know, but it is not porsche who has some explaining to do here about tweaking. nissan abbilities? you mean the ability to cheat? yeah they are quite good with that...ok just joking..i mean the gtr is a good car especially for the money, but i siply dont belive that it is as fast as nissan claims, unless there are some tweaks. tell me? do you honestly believe that the nissan could possibly have so much deviation between the horsepower figures? does that not seems suspicius to you? I personaly think it s a pretty clever trick...and you still havent answered my question why wont nissan make any profit on teh gtr?

It's a pointless discussion

Now until someone does some coastdown tests or pulls a motor and puts it on an engine dyno, you're allowed to be as skeptical as you want but you'll still have no proof. Nissan credits their unusually low driveline losses to ultra low friction bearings, and correctly aligned driveline parts: did you know that the GT-R's suspension and driveline is assembled on a hydraulic rig that simulates the full weight of the car, so that when the actual body goes on there is no deflection or deviation from stock alignment specs? Name another company that does that for it's street cars... go on, I dare you. Did you also know that the driveshafts are carbon fiber? What about the fact that the GT-R can shift almost all it's torque rearward and act like a RWD car? So why the hell are we using standard calculations for driveline loss?

Taking all these things into consideration, I'd be willing to assume the GT-R does have less driveline friction than most cars. I'm not willing to bet on the actual percentage, but logic dictates that I take their word for it until proven otherwise.

the argument that gt-r is low friction is the stupidest i have ever heard to be honest, it never was and never will be.

You are so confused it's unbelievable. You are confusing the difference between friction and rotational inertia... making the driveshafts lighter by using carbon fiber reduces rotational inertia, not friction. Tires would NOT contribute to driveline friction either.

Rear mounted transmission means you have to use a carbon driveshaft? Umm... no. The Ferrari 599 & 612 both have the tranny in the back and they use aluminum. And you're trying to "educate me" because you went and looked up dual clutch boxes on Google? Please... and unless the car is operating in AWD mode, driveline friction on the front shaft won't matter... no transfer of torque through the front shaft means there's no power there to be lost through friction anyway.

And for the record Nissan DID release the info on the low friction bearings in the GT-R's transaxle. manufacturers would all strive for the lowest friction in all bearings? GET A CLUE!!! Have you any idea of the different kinds of manufacturing processes, materials and coatings used in bearing manufacture, and the cost and complexity between each type? Do you think GM uses the same type of bearings in a Cobalt that it does in a ZR1? It's you who needs education.

we have people abusing porsche and they dont even know about manufactering a car let alone mechanics, lol

It doesn't matter if the GTR is "faster", but only for a brief moment, Porsche have plenty of time to improve their 911, so seriously whats the point with all this bashing its going to be the same in the next model and the next.

the warranty thingy sounds really bad, probably too expensive to fix or maybe they know the problem will be a common thing and they are not up for bankruptcy.

so all in all, who cares, just buy whatever car an shut up ;)

Its up to the buyer, who wants what, Porsche has Rear bias for their car speaks individualism, but weight distribution is no mistery to porsche, I dont think nissan are such a surprise with their production.

Its pretty poor to see Nissan not deliver the proper information to the public, this is the reason that things are lets say "out of hand".

People expect Porsche to reply to Nissan, Time is on Porsche's side anyway.