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And you have to wonder why Chrysler is having money issues..hmmm

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haha even the koreans are making better cars than the americans! wake detroit, battle back the glory days..its a win win situation for everyone

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all american huh?

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Nissan and Hyundai aren't American...

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wake USA,korean do better than u?????????god help detroit.

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hehehe, american cars are only bought by americans, and even they regret it. Ah well, when a chinese or arabic consortium buys out the entire US car industry maybe they'll sort it out

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The Korean's do not have one original thought when it comes to building cars. I do not recognize any of their auto company's as respectful ones. But I am also not an apologist for the American autos either, but I do see them turning around (well at least GM and Ford). The only reason why the Crown Vic was on the list was because it has been ignored for several years to the point where Ford will no longer sell them at dealers as 08 models.

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The new Sonata, the Azera, the upcoming Tiburon replacement, and several other new and up-coming Hyundais and Kias seem like very respectable cars, and while they may not be entirely original, at least they're more original than the average Toyota/Lexus/Honda/Acura/Nissan/etc., and if Toyota calls Hyundai "a great enemy" then there's definitely something to both fear and respect. Also, don't believe/buy everything you hear/read about American cars being "awful" - many new American cars are miles away from past efforts by Detroit. It's also been proven by independent researchers that the average person actually has a preconceived notion that Japanese cars are better than American cars, which was proven by reskinning American cars as Japanese cars and Japanese cars as American cars and testing out the public's reactions to both cars, which, interestingly enough, seemed to show almost every time that the potential buyer will simply convince him/herself that the "American" car they got to test was much worse than the "Japanese" car they got to test in pretty much every way imaginable. I don't trust people's opinions and misconceptions. Hell, even now with the continuously (and might I add, rapidly) deteriorating and sorry state that Toyota's quality, reliability, and real world gas mileage seem to be slipping into, every single person out there still believes there's nothing as reliable and "high-quality" as a Toyota. Meanwhile, a friend's old Pontiac is still going strong without any problems after 9 years of continued hard work, and no one seems to notice.... And I don't even LIKE most American cars - sad then that it takes for someone like ME to point out what should be glaringly obvious....

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nice US work jajajaj as always crapy cars

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korean cars doing better than Americans? I guess korean car companies are copying others, that's probably why they're earning a little buck, but not because they're being authentic. Korean cars suck!

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Wasn't Chrylser scuttled by some German company?

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That's what they said, but even Chrysler's own internal management admitted that they screwed themselves over. They had access to all the parts and technologies the Daimler-Chrysler group (thanks to Mercedes-Benz) could throw at them, and they did next to nothing with it.... The best use they found for any of it was to reskin an old E-Class as the 300C/Charger/Magnum/etc. and to make the Crossfire from the old SLK. In fact, it was MB who dumped Chrysler because they'd had enough of Chrysler's mismanagement and lack of profit generation.

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I still like the Dodge Magnum though. I would rather have added the Nissan Almera or something like that to the list.

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dodge Magnum is the coolest estate in a long time- only s/rs audi avants can compete. a cool estate is a hard thing to achieve in my opinion

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Looks aside, German estate not only "compete" but quite easily outdo the Magnum. Let's not forget the M5 Estate, the E63 Estate, or the cheaper but still impressive New Passat R36 Wagon. And the reason the Magnum is dynamically competent enough to be on this list is because it's based on the old E-class.

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yeah i never believe these lists its all just opinion. for example if the ford edge was #7 on the list no one would know the difference.

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It's almost obvious that there's a good deal of bias against American cars going on on this list. Sure, the average American car is pretty bad, and I'd be the first to admit it, but this goes too far.... This definitely seems to be mere opinions than anything else.

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people that defend american cars are just being patriotic. the ONLY car america makes with pride are the z06's. check the used prices on the cars on that list and mouths will drop. our cars are made for 55-65mph highways. they don't last long in cities like l.a. because traffic, heat and hills show the vehicles true colors. why do you think the new caddy cts is getting such rave reviews? it was schooled in germany. the big three has put themselves in a hole. they don't care about quality or luxury, they just make people movers. someone name one american car made between 1980 and 2000 that makes you say, "now thats a car" or "isn't that thing beautiful?" all together now, the corvette zr-1 and the 1996 impala are timeless. as is the 3rd gen camaro. ever wonder why we can't sell alot of turbo'd or supercharged family cars but the germans spit them out consistently at outrageous prices? i mean, why spend 70-80k for a new sts-v when you could get a '04 cl65 or '03 rs6 for 45k and kick serious butt in style and comfort knowing that you can outlast the american car and have better resale value? its called lasting value people, how 'bout asking the big three to offer it to us?

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Well...there is the Saleen S7. And the Chrysler 300C. And the Mosler MT900. And the Callaway C16. And the Ford Mondeo that's being sold here, in the U.K. P.S. How on earth do you get a CL65 for 45k? Here you would have to pay more than triple that.

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i said '03-'04. used. goto autotrader.com and see for yourself. use a zip code like 90210 and search all of america. german supercars are not expensive because they aren't produced in limited numbers, especially amg cars. some of the best engines on the road. the s7 isn't timeless, sir. what car is with that many wings, vents and louvers? 300c is a flying brick with a hacked off rear. i hate fords with a passion but i think the new 'stang is way more beautiful than the mondeo. the big three is self destructing with all these retro cars they make. you are supposed to learn from the past, not live in it. long live the vw group. (audi,bentley,bugatti,porsche)

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how could i forget? lamborghini is a vw family member as well. how can you go wrong with the vw group. people talk bad about them, but in the end, they are THE most impressive automaker by far. anyone that disagrees is doing so just to hold conversation. and unlike the big three in america, they have no need to compete with each other. why? because family sticks together.

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Have fun with your faulty auto computer systems which in return makes you visit the dealer very frequently. I like Audi, they have some beautiful cars out, but I don't think I would ever buy them because they are unrealiable. Plus, it would feel like just an expensive VW. I'd rather go with a Ferrari than a Lambo (not a true Italian car anymore). Only two brands that I like in the VW portfolio are the Porsche and Bugatti (Bently is just not my style). Sorry, I just prefer BMW's or Mercedes Benz. You just seem to be very biased towards VW. I will agree that the Chrysler 300C is a flying brick, but it did receive the reaction "now that's a car" from millions of people, which in turn also made it one of the most award winning cars of this generation.

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stop, i'm starting to weep. impressive - toyota and honda. when think of who makes good auto product, longevity and resale are what i look for. the VW 'family' can't do quality the way toyota and honda do. not even close. and thats a fact.

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Actually, MiracleWhipp, your false opinions and illusions about quality are laughable, if not outrageous. Toyota and Honda aren't even close to impressive. They spend billions of dollars every year on improving quality and reliability of their cheaper cars under NORMAL driving, and they still can't quite pull it off. The only reason German cars aren't considered as reliable as Toyotas and Hondas is because A) they're driven MUCH harder than your average Honda/Toyota and B) because the British and American motoring press hate Germany and German cars and don't even do a great job of disguising that fact, and C) because reliability isn't even the kind of business they're really in (and yet they do a great job because they focus on quality, which reflects itself as reliability in certain departments at least), and D) the average German car weighs a lot more and has a lot more power and torque and expensive and technologically/electronically complex equipment than the average Japanese car, and THAT is a FACT, not what you read in a tuner magazine or a "report" in edmonds or autotrader or TopGear or at your local shop where they focus on the immediate results without focusing on the causes, and plentifully sprinkle some good old fashioned bias to force their unfair opinions onto the unsuspecting public as "fact". Longevity is relative as is, like it or not, coming from a family that has owned several German AND Japanese cars, I can say with at least SOME certainty that none of the Japanese cars we've owned (including our current 2002 Camry) are anything CLOSE to reliable or even good quality in either build, fit or finish, or engineering/dynamics, whereas even our 1978 5-series exceeded expectations. As for resale: the numbers speak for themselves; that's why no one on a tight budget will be able to afford a second-hand German car, save maybe a very cheap and badly bruised old VW. I know because I'm in the market for one myself, and I can find whole fleets of used and relatively new Japanese cars that are dirt cheap for almost no reason other than the fact that the owners know they can't push the pieces of dull crap for any more green.... Toyota and Honda (and ESPECIALLY Toyota) are actually slipping in the quality and reliability department anyway, which means what little they had left is already disappearing.

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A few things you said are far from the truth, johnnyg. Faulty auto computer systems, for one, aren't exactly a common occurence on VWs, especially the brand new ones.... As for Audis feeling like expensive VWs: hasn't happened to anyone yet. VWs themselves feel higher quality than the typical image of VW that everyone has built into their minds, and Audis are still higher quality than that - in fact Audis (just on the interior finish and design both inside and outside of the car alone) are in a world of their own.... And I doubt your "reliability" argument is based on experience, because I know at least 4 Audi owners who happen to both love and drive their cars to death, and don't report even the slightest hitch, save a broken front fender here and there, which is actually the result of hard driving through tough terrain.... Undernormal use, rarely do I hear people complain too much about their Audis/VWs (at least here in Canada). As for the Ferrari vs. Lamborghini argument: I wouldn't even go there. Ferraris are exciting and continuously improving cars, but Lamborghini is still ahead, and beating them where it counts. I see no reason why being "Italian" is great in and of itself - in fact, since the VW/Audi ownership of Lambo began, they've been doing much better, both in the quality and reliability department, and in everything else that makes Lamborghini what they are (except for perhaps the designs, which have admittedly taken a bit of a "hit" with the German common-sense playing its part). A true Italian car? Pfft, I don't even care.... I'd sooner buy an Alfa or a Maserati or Pagani or Lamborghini or a Lancia Stratos if I wanted a "true" Italian car. And all this from a person like myself who is a BMW/Porsche man first, and a VW/Audi fan 2nd, if not 3rd or lower.... Also, I actually agree with your comment about the 300C - it's a succesful car because it's dynamically good enough, and has the attitude/style bit nailed on the head; I actually stopped and stared at it the first time I saw it displayed at a local mall in Vancouver a few years back (and that was AFTER having already seen it in Magazines and online) - but then I can't ignore the fact that it truly IS a brick, and not a driver's car by any means. Sure, it'll do fine in a straight line, and it's got the flash, but that's pretty much it. A successful and high-selling atractive brick on wheels. And not to deliberately damage the car's reputation more so, but I've heard of more than one instance of engine failure on the 300C and the SRT-8 (even on the 300's relative, the Charger), and even witnessed one on the Hemi 5.7 Charger myself, where a brand new example of the car was delivered on the owner's birthday, and died right after he first ignition (engine simply refused to start, and was pronounced dead shortly after). I never heard what exactly went wrong with the engine, but if the story is true (which has a higher-than 50% likelihood of being so), it would simply serve as further proof for the kinds of woes that have been slowly killing the Chrysler group. Hopefully LLC can turn things about a little bit....

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I realy miss those wonderful and non-running EU cars like the renaults and peugeots. The M$B's have a great reputation as unrealiable. Lets throw in the smart just for fun, nice transmission.

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Much of their bad reputation is unjustly attributed to them, though.... I'd actually buy an old S-Class from the early 90's or late 80's over anything else, seeing as to how they run forever without problems and seem to please their owners almost 100% of the time.... But I agree with the first thing you said - I wish we had Peugeots, Citroens, and Renaults here.... French cars are really in their own dimension most of the time - if they were a bit more reliable they'd really get the job done. Too bad we don't get them here.... :(

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North American Manufacturers created their problem with perception way back in the 60's when then unknown little cars began arriving from Japan, called Toyota and Datsun with Mazda not far behind. At first, the North American Makers, and the public at large, treated these vehicles with utter contempt. Then, when the makers saw that toyotas and Datuns were capturing the publics interest, and their money, they came out with a couple of half hearted attempts at getting into the small car market. Everyone who remembers the Chevrolet Vega, and the Ford Pinto, does so with a shake of their heads today. Putting it bluntly, they were so bad they were embarassing! Those early Japanese imports were cheap, reliable and economical,..they were also pretty basic transportation. The end result was predictible, Japanese cars gained a large segment of the market, and the North American makers have been playing catchup ever since. Many of the products coming out of Detroit and Dearborn today are superiour to anything in the past, but it will take many years to turn public opinion around.

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wow. there are alot of misinformed people here. johnnyg, companies race to show how dependable parts are. look at the audi r8 and r10 and talk to me about reliability then. the 300c was a success cause it was built from leftover e-class parts, which gave it a better ride, it didn't improve quality. at only 35k, it should sell millions, most cars in that $ bracket will. that true italian comment, a wise man once said 'the best cars ever made will be designed by italians and assembled by germans'. the TRUE ITALIAN walter de'silva is vw design chief. yes i'm biased toward the vw group, if you open your eyes, you'll see that no other manufacturer comes close. why do you think porsche wants in? just so you'll know, bugatti doesn't build the veyron, vw does. i guess for 1.5mil that feels like an expensive vw as well.

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i can tell who drives in nice weather. you amg and m people need to get real and try driving your cars in the rain and snow and ice. whats that you say? you might spin out and wreck your expensive p.o.s. cause you don't have quattro? your car didn't come with a limited slip diff that works BEFORE traction control kicks in? hate on haters. le mans podiums will keep eluding amg and m.

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Everyone is a little bias and most people stand behind the products that THEY know. I have a friend who loves Nissans as his family has owned them for several years and I have a friend who loves Fords and My father loves Toyotas he neglects to keep up maintenence on it and it lasted for 8 years which is pretty good with doing less than the bare minimum with about 180k miles. alot of reliability not only has to do with the parts it starts with maintence. Yeah you can have quality parts but if you don't maintain them the they break down point blank. A company is only good as the reputation that preceeds them. I agree with oldtimer63

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I find a lot of these comments quite comical! Not saying the domestics are the best..domestics have come a long way. The "Big 3" will still have a good portion of the planet interested in purchasing their vehicles. Why you ask? Simply because it's "cheaper" in general (compared to most imports) and partly due to some loyalty, dedication, etc..to one's country. Other countries that buy believe it or not love the "excess" of American products...space-wise, engine-wise, etc...despite being un-eco friendly and blah, blah, blah. Sure there are always the z06's,zr1's and every halo supercar any of us can think of...but the simple fact remains is that not everybody can afford a $50, 80, 100K+ car...(much less the super tuner versions). Surprise, surprise..the average Joe will still be making up the bread and butter vehicles...domestics...entry level and mid range typically make up most manufacturers bottom line. I'm sure they'd all love to sell "only" their halo supercars...but that's just reality and they all know it. Even when I've spent years in Europe and Asia...wtf?! Not everybody was driving a M5, Porsche, Ferrari, etc. Just because we read about all of these wonderful cars doesn't mean the entire planet is comprised of affluent people. Only a moron would compare a average Joe Blow car with a M5,etc...for the amount one would pay for such opulent luxury...it better be able to coddle that elitist ass.