VW & Audi fighting over EV strategy - report

 VW & Audi fighting over EV strategy - report
Audi A1 e-tron live in Geneva 02.03.2010

Will the Wankel get wacked?

The sparks are flying in Germany as Volkswagen and Audi are fighting over the brand's EV strategy.

Details are sketchy, but the Financial Times Deutschland is reporting Audi wants to develop electric vehicles independently of Volkswagen. This hasn't made the parent company happy as sources have indicated VW has "frowned upon" Audi's "anarchist project."

The real problem seems to be Audi's refusal to drop the Wankel engine from the A1 e-Tron. If Audi keeps the engine, it would be a costly move as Volkswagen doesn't build a rotary engine and they'd be forced to develop it with another partner - possibly Mazda.

As we have previously reported, the A1 e-Tron features a 12 kWh lithium-ion battery which powers an electric motor that produces a continuous 45 kW (61 PS / 60 hp) and 150 Nm (111 lb-ft) of torque. It can travel up to 50 km (31 miles) on electricity alone, before a Wankel engine activates to recharge the batteries.

Source: Financial Times Deutschland via Auto Motor und Sport

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 Garais87 Garais87
I think, that if Audi been working alone they been much succesfull than they already is.... how we all now than Audi was bigest earner in VW group last year..... without Audi VW group will go down..... Audi4ever!!! :)
January 4, 2011 2:34 pm
 KeyboardWarrior KeyboardWarrior
What's the fight about??? They must realise who the parents are. In this case VW and they shouild always listen to VW, as they have in the past. Now that Audi wants to copy BMW in making electric cars, they think they know it all and don't want anything to do with VW? Let's not forget that without VW, Audi will be a big flop. Without VW's Golf, how can Audi have a profitable A3 as the A3 is a Golf with a different skin and badge. The same goes with the A4 and Jetta, A6 with Passat, Q7 with Toureg and that Q5 with the smaller VW. Bottom line is that without VW, Audi has nothing to sell. They would have to develop all their cars from scratch, which will make it not viable. So Audi people, stop trying to be exclusive when in fact you are nothing but in the first place and let's not forget that all your products are VW products anyway. And for those of you who think Audi is the most successful brand in the VW Group, think again. Audi's profits are as a result of VW taking all the knock in its own (VW) financial statements even though it is an expenditure/investment for the entire VW Group. My point is that Audi will be making huge losses if it wasn't for VW, using VW products rebadged. A good example is the R8, look at the emense loss that that car is making for Audi. Audi on its own cannot stand.
January 5, 2011 2:04 am
 Jeff_Lux Jeff_Lux
@KeyboardWarrior For your info: Audi A3 shares the platform of the VW golf, the platform, some engines and electric parts, that's it. It is no only body panels that they change. A4 is NOT on a Jetta...Jetta is a longer Golf platform. A6 is NOT a Passat platform but Passat is on Golf platform again.....Q7 shares platform like Cayenne with Touareg and engines... And the Q5 is NOT a VW Tiguan but platform of A4 & A5. Tiguan is Golf platform.
January 5, 2011 3:46 pm
 Microice Microice
VW is losing the plot somehow. It wants everyone to share everything and reduce costs but at the price of a brand's individuality. The other problem is Audi's EV strategy is not the same as VW's so this sorta thing is bound to happen.
January 4, 2011 2:43 pm
 autoficianado autoficianado
This is what happens when you want to be the biggest automaker, it's called economies of scale and it is what helps Audi's profit using VW group components. I think Audi is feeling slightly inferior since Porsche has stolen some of their turf after joining the VW group.
January 4, 2011 4:39 pm
 Microice Microice
@ auto: economies of scale alone will not make the VW group the biggest automaker if consumers feel they are buying the same car in a different skin. That didn't work for GM! Just how much of an Audi will be Audi and not VW, Audi and Porsche parts glued together...
January 4, 2011 6:07 pm
 liquid stereo liquid stereo
The folks leading Audi are nuts. Economies of scale. Who gives a flying finger about the black box that charges the batteries. A wankel would be good because of the high speeds (RPM) and lack of torque. But should they not make the case. Audis are nice but they're too expensive The price premium is just too much. This from someone who looked at the Eos and A4.
January 4, 2011 9:14 pm
 bobbybob bobbybob
why bother to develop new wankel rotary? they already have powerful & efficient enough TDI. Diesel-Electric is already a proven concept. BMW also go this way for their vision efficient dynamic.
January 5, 2011 2:02 am
 Edison Edison
I think the point here is weight reduction and compactness, which the Wankel is good for. However, Wankels do have drawbacks such as relative fuel economy and oil consumption (inherent to the engine design). Diesel is a good choice, but making a small but refined diesel that is compact and light enough may be a challenge. Not sure. An interesting engine would be a tiny (~500cc) 2-cylinder boxer gasoline engine with Atkinson cycle head. You get compactness, lightness, fuel economy, low center of gravity, and NVH could be mitigated (witness TwinAir, albeit TwinAir is an inline 2). Just some thoughts. In any case, whatever engine they do choose to use as a range extender they would probably have to develop new as no other engine in the VW range would fit the bill well enough. They may be able to get economies of scale if they have this new engine as the VW corporate range extender for all VW sub-brand extended range EVs, not just Audis.
January 5, 2011 10:09 am
 ReaperW2 ReaperW2
To KeyboardWarrior, Audi has been developing their own platforms for years, what's happening no a days with Audi and VW is VW is using Audi's platforms not the other way around. The only exception to this is the A3 and Q7. Not even the Q5 is on the same platform as the Tiguan.
January 5, 2011 8:01 am
 Garais87 Garais87
thats right, seens that @KeyboardWarrior living in some different world. dude are you read this about Audi in BMW.com :D
January 5, 2011 10:48 am
 enzoferrari enzoferrari
Nice try. See Clarkson's review of the VW A1.It is a Polo with a different skin. For the uninformed. Go to the VW and Audi showrooms.Take the catalogues and check the specs of A4 and Golf, A6 and Passat,Tiguan and Q5, Touareg and Q7,etc. The drivetrains ,engines and chassis are identical.Audi is no more than an expensive Vw.
January 5, 2011 12:18 pm
 Thedamned Thedamned
Umm, it depends on the fact if the engine is mounted a longitudinal mounting. Audi still uses most of VW's platforms, except for the newest generation A6 that doesn't share it's platform with Passat. I think this also has to do with the fact that Porsche joined the group and there is a straight on battle going on with Audi and Porsche which will be the more important brand in future. I don't think VW sees any future for Audi's wankel-engine. Me neither TBH.
January 21, 2011 3:41 pm
 GTurbo GTurbo
I remember my current mkIV Golf GTI's platform made the A3 possible. Now, the mkVII Golf design language and powertrain are more Audiesque than VW! VW need to find their own uniqueness in the new era and Audi still remains VW's 'cash cow'! Audi 1 v 0 VW.
January 5, 2011 10:53 am
 GPVG30 GPVG30
I knew this was coming. I dont like the way VW is killing Audi slowly every year. Not only the cars are basically the same in both brands (with different skin), but VW is taking Audi design into their cars. VW cars have become expensive, what happen to the people's car idea? I say let audi be audi and VW do their own things. Heck, even the new Jetta/Bora looks like a small audi now. What a waist of brand and technology.
January 5, 2011 1:20 pm
 XtremeMaC01 XtremeMaC01
with all the legislations on fuel consumption, passenger, road impact etc safety, all cars will eventually be very very similar. they develop an engine and use it in all their cars. chip tune, detune and use it. same goes for the chassis, body panels etc.. its all a part of making more profit by decreasing unit cost..
January 9, 2011 9:32 am